doccop63

Member
Oct 16, 2022
463
732
You are absolutely right. But that's not MrDots' problem. This developer has made massively bad decisions in the past that are now falling on his feet.

It starts with the game DMD. This game, even if many people don't want to hear it to this day, was not originally planned to be the pure vanilla game that it ended up becoming. Rather, it is planned with many routes that should also include sharing content. The vanilla stuff was just planned as one route of many. To this day I still know exactly what tags it was once labeled with: MMF, MFF, sharing, swinging. In fact, that was the reason I was interested in this game in the first place: the prospect of variety. And it wasn't just me. The development took forever and almost only vanilla was made. Of course the fans asked. and they were told crap. It was always said that the vanilla focus would be the first step in order to create the basic foundation. everything else would come later, later, later. Then came the interruption in development, Melody was created. A great game that I still appreciate to this day, by the way. In the meantime, the chatting fans have withdrawn more and more from DMD because they have simply lost patience. Instead, militant vanilla fanboys appoached and there were more and more of them. and they put a lot of pressure on them to drop all the other plans. with success. DMD original plans were changed. And over the years the psiel has been bent, more badly than rightly, into the direction it is today. Until years ago there was a huge dispute in the discord, with the result that MrDots finally decided for the vanilla fans. I was there too. I actually decided back then to join the forum and convince MrDots not to make this mistake. I can still remember the conversations with Jeff Steel very well. Who knows, you might even find the late comments here in the threat if they haven't been deleted. Of course I wasn't successful. With the consequence that the sharing fanbase, the original fnabase, has graciously turned its back on MrDots. and since this day all threats to all MrDots games are virtually dead. About as much is written there in a year as is written in 1 day in threats to money, successful games. which is a disaster. Consider that MrDots once had several thousand patreons. So DMD has been altered beyond recognition. And the fairy tale is still told today that the game was supposedly always planned that way. But that's what it really is: a fairy tale. The game was planned differently, it had a completely different fan base. Back then, MrDots alienated and drove away their original fan base. Many people still haven't forgiven him for that. But okay, so be it. It's the past. You can't change it.

MrDots finally decided on vanilla. So far so good. As I said back then, this is a hopelessly oversaturated market with strong competition. In order to be able to assert itself here, a developer must score points with outstanding quality in order to be successful in the long term. If not, he'll just get lost in the crowd. But in the end, did he deliver? No he did`not! And that's the crux of the matter, which is why fans are now running away from him. This is exactly the situation I warned Jeff Steel about years ago. What happened?

Let's take a look at DMD in detail:

The game is full of dialogues where the player's ear is literally chewed off. Dialogue, dialogues, text walls that hardly ever come to an end. These make up what feels like 80% of the entire game. The team simply has a terrible writer who is unable to keep texts concise, to the point and interesting. MrDots once promised to focus on content featuring all female LIs, at the expense of other content that was once planned but never produced. Did he deliver at the end? Not really. No matter which route you play, 90% of the time you only see the same content: scenes with D and father. The rest feels like side content. No matter which route you play, you almost only see D/F. It's the only route that is really worth playing. When you play Georgia, soon you realize that you still mostly only see the same scenes. Then play the other LI. Things are getting worse rather than better. The individual routes have such minimal differences that it's simply not worth going through these text walls again.

The next bis problem is plagiarism. This started from part 2, but from part 3 it reached its peak. And I won't even mention part 4. I don't know if that was the first scene. But at some point of the game you saw doggy sex between Graham and Olivia on the beach. A great scene, really. But almost without exception, every doggy scene later in the game is a copy of this very scene! Only the woman and the camera angle were changed. The posture was always the same, as were facial expressions and animation. And the same applies to other scenes in the game. And so it goes on practically until the end of the game. From part 3 onwards, the vast majority of all lewd scenes were mere copies of scenes that had already been shown. There were hardly any great, truly unique scenes left.

Last but not least, various story elements that were mentioned at the end of part 2 were no longer taken up at all. For example, D never finished school. The relationship with Graham, because of which they both moved in the first place, wasn't even mentioned later. These are just examples. The game ended with tons of story holes.

What I want to say is:
the game was never developed with the varied routes that it was actually planned with. That's probably MrDots the biggest mistake. But it also never become a really good vanilla either. Because a lot of story content was never fully developed and the focus was exclusively on D/F content, but this almost only consists of copies of already existing scenes, at the expense of all other LI that were neglected. This way a game is garbage. That's right, the game is garbage. People download it because it's so big. They are amazed with anticipation: "This must be something great". It is partly true, even as long as you play the D/F route only. Players start this route and are thrilled. Next they restart and try the Georgina Route. And see over 80, more like 90% or more, of the same content. They are surprised and try out the other LI. And things are getting worse there, not better. Then they are so disappointed that they drop the game. Anticipation disappointed, the game is more illusion than reality. That's sad but true.


Now let's get to sunshine love:
First of all, SL suffered greatly from the DMD failure. On the day DMD threat start to run downhill, it also took SL with him. Although SL is a much higher quality game, it has received relatively little attention. The threat is just as dead as DMD's has been for many years. Updates haven't changed much about that.

Nevertheless, I gave the game a chance at some point. and at first I was really excited. Actually I can't say much negative here. Here the text walls are not as bad as in DMD. Yes, there is a lot of chatter, but much more to the point. The story is largely well told. And all LI got story and lewd scene content, mostly from unique scenes. Of course it could have been more. But it's good as it is. Fact is: the game is wolrds better than DMD. Really! Here the developer seems to have learned something from the mistakes of the past. The game scored points almost everywhere where DMD massively disappointed me. I liked it so much that I even considered joining MrDots' patreon again. So far so good.

But then part 3 came. And here I really thought I was suddenly playing a completely different game. First of all, the part is quite short, compared to part 2. The point for the cut is not well taken. Part 3 hardly has any content. But the disaster is the endings. An ending should actually be the climax of a game. They usually are supposed to be amazed and make the player think, “It was worth it.” But that's not how it is. The endings are played with short, succinct text. And the little existing sex there are is short, boring scenes that aren't even animated. These endings are nothing, neither sexy nor dreamy. You think to yourself, "is that it?". And suddenly I felt like I had DMD. SL, which was a really great, varied game before part 3, suffered a huge drop in quality in part 3.

Get to the point. MrDots ruined his first game, DMD, with massive poor decisions, listened to the wrong guys thus alienating his original fanbase, and also did not satisfy his new fansbase that he had decided on, because in the end a run-of-the-mill game came out that disappears without a word in the mass. and then disappointed all with SL, which also couldn't maintain its great quality at the beginning until the end. And now the team is surprised that their patreons are running away? And on top of this, we are now presented with the Fantasy collection, with dialogues and story, as well as unique sex scenes that are really well done and come across better than almost all of DMD's content combined, which proves that taboo content is MrDot's true talent, exactly what DMD should have been originally. However, with vanilla he clearly reached his limits, as that is not his true talent. Now this team is really trying to win back the fan base that was alienated years ago, in order to fill the gaps left with his last 2 games, which ended up being disappointing, because of which his fans completely rightly left him? It's clear that this doesn't work :rolleyes:

Rather, MrDots should finally leave his Generation Z filter bubble and face the truth: he made the wrong decision back then and only chose vanilla for economic reasons, but therefore for a genre that doesn't really suit him, where he cannot maintain the quality until the end. Then he should create a new team, under a new name, and finally start to develop games with content that really suits him and his team. That's what he has to do if he's going to take this path. because he will not be forgiven for the decision of the past. He completely destroyed his reputation among sharing fans years ago. And he won't get it back under the same name.

Or he finally gets new people in his team who really like vanilla and know how to do it right, especially sensible writers. And finally delivers a game that impresses with its quality from start to finish.

But it doesn't matter which path he takes, his goal is the same: In the end he has to finally deliver quality. He would have had to do that with SL after the disappointment with DMD. But he doesn't, part 3 is garbage that drags the game down. It's no wonder fans are running away from him. If he doesn't manage to impress with quality in his next game and stick to it until the end, he will lose the rest of his fans too.
It's refreshing to read a critique from a Day 1, foundational, fan. So many other critiques that you see here and in other threads, start out critical but wind up being just personal gripes. Nice to read about the nuances of the games changing, the suggestion meetings, and the fan following analysis. Thanks for your POV and well done. (y)
 
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Hyperserver

often the biggest step forward is to "step back"
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Jun 30, 2018
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Melody was good because it fulfilled its role as a stop gap between the transition of DMD to SS and the advent of SL.

Melody delivered what it promised and never promised anything out of bounds for Patreon. It is a straight forward romantic adult visual novel, audiences for which abound.

As exazubi says above DMD set out to appeal to a very different audience than what it changed to cater for, despite moving to a more lenient crowd funding platform; threads like this are an indication that there is still a hankering for its original vision. For the record I have attached a copy of MrDots introduction to DMD on 2016-09-26.

I can't really say much about SL as I tried to play it at least 3 times and got very bored, it hinted at there being a potential but delivered nothing to match the promise of DMD nor the succinct focus of Melody.
that has been 2016 - and time can change many things
so, death? or, exile?
no need for violence - it's enough for me if you go to exile :ROFLMAO:
 
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TD24

Newbie
Nov 1, 2017
21
49
I agree with a lot of what exazubi said.

While I can't remember precisely when I found DMD, I do remember being interested in it because of those original tags.

Obviously it's up to the team how they want to proceed on their projects, but I do find the move towards 'safe' sex tags to be disappointing, and a bit dull.

I was hoping that the fantasy scenes would be an opportunity to try some of the more niche tags, and I think the first release did succeed in that to a degree. However, as things stand it would seem like that might be a one-off. Though I fully accept I have no idea what may come in the future, my current stance is that it's probably a fool's hope to expect more niche content in the future.
 

drakov

Member
Sep 25, 2023
338
436
you mean becoming next top model competition which tyra won originally? didn't they already do it?
They did the scene where Dee goes to the jury guy's room were dee suck and fuck that guy .

I was referring to the scene after the competition , at the after competition party, when Dee refuses to drink with the 2 guys and falls into the pool.The party end with Tyra fucks the jury guy , and , oher girl from the competition make a grup sex with that 2 Guys who Dee refuse earlier !!
 
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latitude64

New Member
Apr 18, 2018
1
0
even it's unsure whether we will do a 2nd part or not, it's 100% sure that IF we do another part, we will not do any more NTR, DP or gangbang though.
Cool, I would loooooove a 5938th sex scene with D+F, I still think think we havent seen one where F fucks D in a on a chair in the livingroom in a grey, yellow and pink house whch belongs to a 58 year old woman called Katie, I think that might be the only scenario left.

Lets just ignore every kink we can! Vanilla for life!

(sarcasm)
 

cxx

Message Maestro
Nov 14, 2017
57,097
28,245
They did the scene where Dee goes to the jury guy's room were dee suck anf fuck that guy .

I was referring to the scene after the competition , at the after competition party, when Dee refuses to drink with the 2 guys and falls into the pool.The party end with Tyra fucks the jury guy , and , oher girl from the competition make a grup sex with that 2 Guys who Dee refuse earlier !!
well possibly but we'll see.
 

herrderr75

Newbie
Aug 5, 2019
18
23
Well well well ...
We haven't had any complaints and/or negative responses from any of our supporters. All rections were positive, and we managed to"cast at least a smile on their face". Even some of the ones who admitted they got fooled had a laugh afterwards.
This is the type of community, we want to interact with, and for these we want to create stuff.
Those, who can't take an April's Fool joke, are not the people we actually want to have - so if we pissed them off, then we have mission accomplished.
Those, who still live in a bubble to believe DMD is still alive, and compare all and everything to DMD, a game which has been finished way too late and should have been done much earlier, and all those, who can't let go ..... yes - to piss off all of those, who unsubscribed some time ago or even never were supporters in the first place, is a goal, which is putting a big smile on our face every single time.

And the fact, that you took your time, to comment our prank over here - (like you do with everything we release) shows that we have "mission accomplished"
We know about your personal vendetta to trash everything we release or everything we do - everybody knows about that - but it's really funny to piss you off over and over again (same goes for all others like you) ;):cool:
Between the classless April Fool's "joke" and this classless response, I've decided to end all support for the Mr. Dots team.
 

kingiceeyes

Member
Aug 2, 2021
132
47
Between the classless April Fool's "joke" and this classless response, I've decided to end all support for the Mr. Dots team.
I read a lot in these days but I really have to say in some aspects you are a bit exaggerated was a simple joke that raw but it made me laugh I laughed like a fool...want to close your experience of support foul I personally continue to admire what they do and I hope they release soon this fantasy part 2 I think you should start to take things more simply
 
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cxx

Message Maestro
Nov 14, 2017
57,097
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well dots made easter render of dee and half sis of sl some years ago and last year made xmas render of sl and april fools joke was prolly their 1st.
 

slackster

Active Member
Feb 1, 2017
825
1,974
Fortunately numbers don't lie:

MrDots Subsrcibestar numbers in June 2022 - 2948

SSDots.PNG

April 2024 - 1565

DotsSS 2024.JPG

a 47% drop

Same trend on Patreon

June 2022 - 2509

April 2024 - 1936

MrDots Pat.JPG

I'm sure doing the same thing over and over again will get more people on board :ROFLMAO:
 

oaiki

Well-Known Member
Mar 19, 2020
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Kryptozoid

Well-Known Member
Sep 3, 2016
1,189
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Ending DMD was a terrible mistake.
It was getting more and more disappointing towards the end, because devs tried to make everyone happy which unsurprisingly resulted in nobody being happy. But it was still way better than SL ever was.

I think they should have a game for normies AND DmD for pervs, it's way easier than to try to satisfy both audience types with one game. Then if normies are the majority, you make 2 or 3 updates of the normie game for one update of the perv game, and that's it, you have a manageable way of making everybody happy. In theory. Then if you start to listen to vocal normies who aren't happy with the content of the perv game that is not aimed at them, you shot yourself in the foot and it's your fault.

But "diversying" your products to satisfy as many people as possible is unatainable if all of the dev team members leans on the same side.

Anyway I digress, all I wanted to say initially was that I wlil never understand the need to have an ending to something that works. And I'm not calling out the team on this, I know there's some people, even among those who liked the game, who wanted it to end. Why ? Who cares, it's a game, just like Bart Simpson, Dee doesn't have to age. And it's a porn game, it's not like you earn virtual street cred because you finished an actual game like Dark Souls or whatever. As long as devs can create fappable stories there's absolutely no reason for a porn game to end.

Also, I have an idea, you can prepare your pitchforks : why not one day reboot DmD as a female protag game ? This way we're sure the normies won't touch it with a ten foot pole, and we can basically have anything the pervs scholars like me want to see.
I personnaly wouldn't mind to have this type of pervy stuff in a male protag game, but apparently there's a rule somewhere stating that some kinks must be in female protag games only. Which I don't mind playing either, so be it if it's the only way. It'll never happen with the current team anyways, don't worry and enjoy clones of SL forever. (couldn't finish in a positive way :D )
 

doccop63

Member
Oct 16, 2022
463
732
It was getting more and more disappointing towards the end, because devs tried to make everyone happy which unsurprisingly resulted in nobody being happy. But it was still way better than SL ever was.

I think they should have a game for normies AND DmD for pervs, it's way easier than to try to satisfy both audience types with one game. Then if normies are the majority, you make 2 or 3 updates of the normie game for one update of the perv game, and that's it, you have a manageable way of making everybody happy. In theory. Then if you start to listen to vocal normies who aren't happy with the content of the perv game that is not aimed at them, you shot yourself in the foot and it's your fault.

But "diversying" your products to satisfy as many people as possible is unatainable if all of the dev team members leans on the same side.

Anyway I digress, all I wanted to say initially was that I wlil never understand the need to have an ending to something that works. And I'm not calling out the team on this, I know there's some people, even among those who liked the game, who wanted it to end. Why ? Who cares, it's a game, just like Bart Simpson, Dee doesn't have to age. And it's a porn game, it's not like you earn virtual street cred because you finished an actual game like Dark Souls or whatever. As long as devs can create fappable stories there's absolutely no reason for a porn game to end.

Also, I have an idea, you can prepare your pitchforks : why not one day reboot DmD as a female protag game ? This way we're sure the normies won't touch it with a ten foot pole, and we can basically have anything the pervs scholars like me want to see.
I personnaly wouldn't mind to have this type of pervy stuff in a male protag game, but apparently there's a rule somewhere stating that some kinks must be in female protag games only. Which I don't mind playing either, so be it if it's the only way. It'll never happen with the current team anyways, don't worry and enjoy clones of SL forever. (couldn't finish in a positive way :D )
You made valid points and I can agree with most of them. What I don't agree with is having the never ending story. ALL things must end. That's just the facts of life. DMD was a lengthy story, just like Grandma's House currently. The fact is, many stories start out as either short stories or novellas but as time goes on, the writer/creator begins to add more things to make the story complete. Many times it's due to the creator's imagination. There's usually that speculation factor that's the cause, (what if he/she does this? What would happen?) and so on.
Then, in the case of these "games" (not all of the things posted in f95 qualifies but I addressed that before in another thread), you look to your fans/audience to give you inspiration. Some work out, others don't. Either way, you push on based on the results. The danger of stretching out the story is twofold. 1) Inevitably, the creator/author runs out of ideas and gets bored. They have new ideas, for new stories and they begin working on it before finishing the original. That happens all of the time, it's called "writer's burnout". It doesn't mean that you didn't like what you put out, it's just time to move on to something fresh. It's like sleeping on linen. It feels comfortable but, eventually, you have to change them.
The second danger, and it's more applicable here, is that, you get stuck on where you're going (called "writer's block"). You listen to the critics, start following their ideas, then you go forward. Now, along the way, the story drifts from your original concept. For those who depend on subscribers, when that happens, you start losing support. You try to bring them back by listening to the whiners, "add this/that, don't add this/that". Pretty soon, you're trying to appease everybody and the story starts getting out of control.

Tom Clancy wrote a number of mega novels that were between 700-1300 pages. He beautifully wove a number of them, based on One character, to tell a grand story which, basically covered the character's career. The problem was that, while doing so, he branched off to tell whole stories about support characters that fans loved. That would have been okay, had he wrapped up the main character's story but he did it while telling ancillary stories. He had to add elements to the secondary stories to make them relevant to the original. Pretty soon, those stories began to suffer as they quickly ran into dead ends. Meanwhile, the original story that started the whole shebang, was nowhere near where it started.
I firmly believe that, if you're going to have a story, you need to have a definitive end. Writing instructors advise 1st timers to have an outline. You put down what you want to tell; the elements in which to tell a story, your pro/antagonist(s), your conflict(s), and an ending. That way it can't get away from you and you don't have to depend on outside sources to finish it. I'm writing a story online currently that's been several years in the making. I constantly have to self edit to make sure that it stays coherent and the scenes are relevant to one another. It AIN'T easy!

The other point that I disagree with is telling two versions of the same thing. For reasons explained above, it's not very feasible, Especially when you have to spend so much time rendering. That's how stories Quickly get away from the main concepts, with both versions winding up being poorly executed. The Best idea is to do the story how you envision it, then Tell it that way. You can use an Occasional suggestion if you think it will help, but if you stick with your script, you can tell your story with satisfaction. You'll ALWAYS have your naysayers and bitchers, that's the way it goes. Humans, especially entitled ones, will always have a gripe. Humanity can't survive without them. The best thing to do is to tell a story the way You want. Please yourself First. If you do it right, mass fans will follow, just like Clancy. If you do it wrong, you try to learn from your mistakes for the next time but the bottom line is do it for your own satisfaction first. Ultimately, it Is Your story to tell.
 
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