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Patreon Is Hardening Their 'Adult Content' Guidelines. Discussion Thread

DarthSeduction

Lord of Passion
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Game Developer
Dec 28, 2017
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I believe MakerSupport is using Stripe to process fees by letting users connect their account to Stripe. They have a list of prohibited businesses and it includes adult content: Pornography and other obscene materials (including literature, imagery and other media); sites offering any sexually-related services such as prostitution, escorts, pay-per view, adult live chat features ( ) So my understanding is that creators and pledgers are dealing directly with Stripe, MakerSupport isn't the go-between. Any adult developer will likely run into trouble.

I've been reading up a bit on payment gateways. My understanding is that most big porn companies use a high risk gateway like CCBill to process credit cards. So unless MakerSupport, or any other platform adds that option, the problem with censorship remains.
I was talking to someone in this thread about maker support a few weeks ago. He was saying that they haven't expressed any concern yet over any type of adult content. I hear what you're saying with stripe, so it could just be a matter of time, but I'm choosing optimism. Like I said DS is actually speaking with them directly about it, so he'll get a definitive answer

Ccbill also prohibits rape bestiality incest and fictional underage content. They're no better than PayPal.
 
M

monkeybird69

Guest
Guest
Make it, I'm begging you!!! Its exactly what I've been looking for.

Fuck censorship, and fuck Patreon. I know money is always an issue when creating, its why I gave up music. But don't let them kill your ideas. I'm sure there's other ways to crowdfund. Plumfund seems like a good alternative but I'm not sure? and you'll always have f95 for exposure.
Hey, thanks for the vote of confidence. I did put my game here on f95 and they keep on deleting it because "The characters look too young" and "hackers and the wrong element might visit the site and cause them problems" Even though Patreon didn't have a problem with it. By the way Patreon's new rules aren't all that strict. Its mainly for the extremely offensive.
 
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DarthSeduction

Lord of Passion
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Dec 28, 2017
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Hey, thanks for the vote of confidence. I did put my game here on f95 and they keep on deleting it because "The characters look too young" and "hackers and the wrong element might visit the site and cause them problems" Even though Patreon didn't have a problem with it. By the way Patreon's new rules aren't all that strict. Its mainly for the extremely offensive.
DMD isn't extremely offensive IMO. It's a romance game for crying out loud. Who cares if a fictional father and his fictional daughter fall in love?
 

kongflcl

Member
Jan 14, 2018
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128
Hey, thanks for the vote of confidence. I did put my game here on f95 and they keep on deleting it because "The characters look too young" and "hackers and the wrong element might visit the site and cause them problems" Even though Patreon didn't have a problem with it. By the way Patreon's new rules aren't all that strict. Its mainly for the extremely offensive.
Wow, even f95 coming through with the bullshit. That's extremely disappointing, they offer a piracy service for god's sake. How could I play your game/what is its name?
 

DarthSeduction

Lord of Passion
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Dec 28, 2017
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Wow, even f95 coming through with the bullshit. That's extremely disappointing, they offer a piracy service for god's sake. How could I play your game/what is its name?
F95 has a thread that addresses this. It's not that they want to, it's that it's necessary to survive. Because they are a piracy platform they already attract unwanted attention. Underage content attracts very unwanted attention.

There are a few games here that have gotten away with lolicon though, so I'm not sure why he's having a problem. Didn't read the original post.
 

kongflcl

Member
Jan 14, 2018
152
128
F95 has a thread that addresses this. It's not that they want to, it's that it's necessary to survive. Because they are a piracy platform they already attract unwanted attention. Underage content attracts very unwanted attention.

There are a few games here that have gotten away with lolicon though, so I'm not sure why he's having a problem. Didn't read the original post.
Ehh, its disheartening but I understand. I'm just confused how "young-looking" characters is such a problem when tiny teen porn is in abundance and some of those actresses definitely look illegal.
 

DarthSeduction

Lord of Passion
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Dec 28, 2017
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Ehh, its disheartening but I understand. I'm just confused how "young-looking" characters is such a problem when tiny teen porn is in abundance and some of those actresses definitely look illegal.
Because crusaders don't give a shit. Those tiny teen porn stars can all show their ID and Birth Certificate. The Tiny Teens in animated content are made up. So these crusaders just decide for themselves what's acceptable and whats not. For now at least, if you want such young characters I'd suggest doing what Family Way did and have a patch available on your own site.
 
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ASLPro3D

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Sep 16, 2017
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Figured I would chime in some here and share my take on what's recently been transpiring as someone who produces/releases a game on Patreon and as someone who's had websites of their own sort of like Patreon.

Buckle up folks, this is going to be some heavy reading!

First of all, the facts...

1.) Patreon and their servers are located in the United States, while they do not necessarily host the files that are provided from creators to their patrons, they do provide website space and image sharing. This is important to note, as they are susceptible to the state and federal laws that pertain to the location that their servers are located and can be harassed, sopenad and in some case be held liable for the content that passes or is distributed on their servers.

2.) Patreon does a lot more than just adult games, files, videos and whatnot... and though it does produce a large amount of income, it is not their primary business... the fact that they do allow for adult business/product sales to take place on their website opens them up to risk... or as an Internet Merchant Account/Banking institution would classify it as "High Risk", where a large amount of credit card declines and charge backs can occur.

3.) On the subject of the aforementioned Banking, Patreon must adhere to the principles set forth by their Internet Merchant Account/Banking Institution, as well as, any principles and limitations that they agree to when conducting business with ANY merchant accounting business (such as PayPal)... these institutions and banks are very clear in what they will or will not allow in the matter of "High Risk Adult Content/Products" and Patreon must adhere to those limitations or risk losing their Internet Merchant Account and money charging processes... and, I assure you, the limitations and penalties ARE severe!!!

4.) When a company like Patreon submits a request for an Internet Merchant Account and Gateway, it requires a "Secure Server License" that is required for the Gateway to tell the bank that owns the Internet Merchant Account that the website is secure... meaning that when a person types in their banking information to conduct a transaction, that information is securely encrypted and that 3rd party people cannot access that information... to subscribe for that yearly license, the website is scanned once or twice a year to be sure that it adheres to the standards set forth by the Internet Merchant Account (i.e. bank) including, but not limited to, the terms of service set forth by those banking institutions as well as any terms set by the business providing the Secure Server License.

With all of that said, I can assure you that Patreon's Internet Merchant Account holder (i.e. bank), because Patreon allows the sale of adult services and products, also has an established liquid asset fund (or what I call an extortion fee) that must remain constantly in the bank (usually a set percentage) in the event of the usual high volume of charge backs and credit card declines... this "extortion fee" is held by the bank, for no less than 9 months after the Internet Merchant Account has been closed by the business conducting adult sales and transactions.

Meaning, that if Patreon was dissatisfied with the service, rates or exchange fees of the bank holding their Internet Merchant Account, the bank can hold that reserve money (extortion fee) for 9 months to a year an a half before releasing it back to the owners of Patreon... in addition, Patreon, if all they were doing was switching to a different Internet Merchant Account (bank) would also have to fill that bank's determined reserve before they could open for business...

So, if one bank is holding say $100,000.00 USD in reserve against potential charge backs and declines, and the new bank also wants a $100,000.00 USD reserve to protect themselves, that means Patreon has $200,000.00 USD of their money held hostage by the banks that they can never touch and can only get back after 9-18 months of Merchant Account Closure minus any bank transactional fees... so for 9-18 months, Patreon wouldn't be able to get the $100,000.00 USD from their first Internet Merchant Account... that money sits there until the bank decides to release it.

Now with all of that said... the banks truly hold all of the power, not Patreon... the banks. The banks at anytime can decide to clean up their portfolios in preparation to sell their bank to another banking institution (I know, I've had this happen to me while running an adult website), suddenly forcing you to find a new Internet Merchant Account (bank) that will allow you to do adult business, so that the bank that is up for sale looks spiffy and clean to a potential buyer.

Additionally, they can change their policy ANY TIME, WITHOUT notice... if they don't like something they see on your website, they can instruct the website owner to remove it or they will close the Internet Merchant Account down and fine you... causing your money to sit in limbo or till they feel like letting it go... nothing you can do.

THAT is the reality of running a website that conducts financial business on the Internet... so yeah, Patreon is suddenly cracking down on content that could cost them their Internet Merchant Account... which means not just the Adult sector of Patreon wouldn't be able to make money, but ALL OF THEIR CREATORS and website owners wouldn't be able to do business.

Realistically, and quite honestly, the fact that Patreon does and has been allowing adult creators to conduct and sell stuff on their website amazes me... as it IS "High Risk" and could put their entire business model at risk if the banks decide to force Patreon to change (which it looks like they have)... if I had been the owner of Patreon, I would've opened a separate website business sole for adult businesses and services, this way if a bank DID decide to pressure me that they couldn't shut my NON-ADULT business down, only the adult one... plus, I would also have a lower reserve on the non-adult merchant account... but, apparently, the owners of Patreon don't have the experience that I sadly had to learn over the last 20 years... but they are now.

Long story short... what you are witnessing isn't really all of Patreon's fault... if they are to blame for anything, it is for not better managing the adult area to adhere to the Banking Institutions requirements and are likely paying the price for it right now.

That's what you really see happening here folks... choose to believe it or not, but I am 99.9% positive of it.
 

DarthSeduction

Lord of Passion
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Dec 28, 2017
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Hey ASL, your own game has incest sexual assault and bestiality content, what are your plans moving forward?
 
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ASLPro3D

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Hey ASL, your own game has incest sexual assault and bestiality content, what are your plans moving forward?
Actually, the bestiality in it is only implied and referenced... the reader pretty much creates the scene in their head. As for the assault that takes place on Claire by her brother William, it wasn't done 'gratuitously' or done in a way to 'elicit sexual arousal' it was done to show the horrors of rape and the effects that it can have on a person.

So I sort of skirted the line... ;)

But my game was "reported" and checked... actually for none of the above mentioned reasons, but because someone took offense to the fact that players are "forced" to assume the role of the "Antichrist"... like I am holding a gun to people's heads and forcing them to play or be a patron of my game.

Regardless, I may have to reconsider some of my previous ideas for the direction of the story in regard to incest, however, any planned scene that was going to incorporate it or show it was still a few months away from occurring as I am still setting up the characters and backstory... so I still have time to sit, watch and wait to see how long the torches and pitchforks are around, but as a writer, I can swap things around a bit without missing a step. :)

But ONE THING I can assure you of... there is NO WAY that I am going to go back to running an adult website and brokerage like Patreon again... I've written to them and have offered my services and knowledge to them if they want it, but there is NO WAY I want to go back to running a site of my own again! :D
 

DarthSeduction

Lord of Passion
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Dec 28, 2017
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When I was writing it I wasn't really thinking about the claire scene either. My own project actually starts with a sexual assault in that context. I was more talking about how you treat the demon princess. And yes, you're right that the bestiality isn't depicted, but I wasn't sure you weren't planning on exploring it further. It would really be sad to see you censored. You're one of my favorite creators at the moment. Have you considered moving to a more accepting platform?
 

DarthSeduction

Lord of Passion
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Dec 28, 2017
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As of now, thanks to f95, my game is only available on patreon. It's called Forever Young.
Ah, makes sense now. I personally see how your project is just fine, but I also see why a group of anti cp hackers wouldn't care and would attack F95 to see it gone. Too bad. You could consider having your own developer forum... nothing huge, just a place outside patreon to talk development and ideas.
 
M

monkeybird69

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Guest
Ah, makes sense now. I personally see how your project is just fine, but I also see why a group of anti cp hackers wouldn't care and would attack F95 to see it gone. Too bad. You could consider having your own developer forum... nothing huge, just a place outside patreon to talk development and ideas.
My game has no nudity of the said underage looking character yet f95 still won't let it on their site.
 

Ignazzio

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May 8, 2017
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Looks like Gumdrop (Dual Family) will move to Gamejolt if he'll be suspended. He already has an account there and he said it's been good for him so I presume he's gathering some funds there. Anyone knows if Gamejolt has paypal? If it has it might be actually a fine solution. I would love such a site where we pay for a product and not monthly. That way, really ambitious games could be made without this monthly rushed bullshit. I have some hopes in it
 

DarthSeduction

Lord of Passion
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Game Developer
Dec 28, 2017
3,360
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Looks like Gumdrop (Dual Family) will move to Gamejolt if he'll be suspended. He already has an account there and he said it's been good for him so I presume he's gathering some funds there. Anyone knows if Gamejolt has paypal? If it has it might be actually a fine solution. I would love such a site where we pay for a product and not monthly. That way, really ambitious games could be made without this monthly rushed bullshit. I have some hopes in it
It probably doesn't paypal is the source of the issue

And I checked out his page there. Dual Family is definitely worth more than 5 bucks
 

Siddington

Member
Sep 11, 2017
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854
This is what Dual Family's Gumdrop games had to say about the situation on his Discord

GumdropGames-Today at 6:56 AM

For the record, whether or not Patreon is the primary platform to support development, I will NOT be halting development. Dual Family will be completed, regardless of the platform


I've been using Game Jolt as a secondary platform since the Summer and it has been pretty good to me. In the worst case scenario of Patreon requiring the game to be erased completely, I would lean on Game Jolt for releases and hurry the site that I've been working on.


GumdropGames-Today at 7:01 AM

However, I haven't been approached about changing the content of my game as of yet -- the review my page received in October left them satisfied with my page removing any mention of "family" or similar words to make it a generic adult game


If they do decide to knock on my door again, I would expect a request of content change (wordage of Mom, Sis, etc) to be removed rather than a complete shut down notice as we're seeing up top. That would warrant a second version of the game, the former uncensored version always being available elsewhere


It's wishful thinking regardless so I will be hurrying my development on the website with a subscription API similar to Patreon as a backup. In the event that I'm swiftly axed with only a few days to act, I would release via Game Jolt as I already have been doing


So long story short, Dual Family isn't going anywhere! Don't sweat it


Patreon or not, the story will continue
 

DarthSeduction

Lord of Passion
Donor
Game Developer
Dec 28, 2017
3,360
5,213
This is what Dual Family's Gumdrop games had to say about the situation on his Discord

GumdropGames-Today at 6:56 AM

For the record, whether or not Patreon is the primary platform to support development, I will NOT be halting development. Dual Family will be completed, regardless of the platform


I've been using Game Jolt as a secondary platform since the Summer and it has been pretty good to me. In the worst case scenario of Patreon requiring the game to be erased completely, I would lean on Game Jolt for releases and hurry the site that I've been working on.


GumdropGames-Today at 7:01 AM

However, I haven't been approached about changing the content of my game as of yet -- the review my page received in October left them satisfied with my page removing any mention of "family" or similar words to make it a generic adult game


If they do decide to knock on my door again, I would expect a request of content change (wordage of Mom, Sis, etc) to be removed rather than a complete shut down notice as we're seeing up top. That would warrant a second version of the game, the former uncensored version always being available elsewhere


It's wishful thinking regardless so I will be hurrying my development on the website with a subscription API similar to Patreon as a backup. In the event that I'm swiftly axed with only a few days to act, I would release via Game Jolt as I already have been doing


So long story short, Dual Family isn't going anywhere! Don't sweat it


Patreon or not, the story will continue

That's good to know. Dual Family has one of the better stories of all the games I've played.