Who exactly is making the rules and why doesn't other websites have to follow them? There are a lot of websites that host adult content that display sexual abuse and deviant behavior.
Patreon Acquires F95
- Thread starter Kal995
- Start date
- Aug 3, 2017
- 579
- 1,424
Governments, Corporations, CC Companies etc.
They do !
You must be registered to see the links
OBSCENITY, ABUSE, HARM
- Bestiality, rape, or incest
- Lewd, filthy, or disgusting words or pictures
- Synthetic media and deepfakes, whether created with or without the use of Artificial Intelligence (aka, “AI”).
- Animal cruelty or abuse in any shape or form - presenting, advocating, or promoting.
- Live child abuse imagery and child pornography
- Services, conversations, products that promote hate, violence, discrimination, terrorism, harassment, or abuse of any kind
- Self-harm or suicide
You must be registered to see the links
We don’t allow hosting content that includes pornographic images or videos of real-life humans. Fictional, illustrated, and rendered content is generally fine, assuming it’s legal. Content glorifying sexual violence is not permitted. Depictions of minors, minor-presenting, or suggested minors in a sexual context are not allowed and will result in account suspension.
No one is talking about websites, we are discussing, in this context, companies that offer services, porn game dev's that use those services and porn game dev's that have been banned from those services.
You must be registered to see the links
" Patreon is a monetization platform operated by Patreon, Inc., that provides business tools for content creators to run a subscription service and sell digital products."
In order to reach the widest audience, patreon must use the most widely used payment options.
Those that run, invest and own those payment options have rules and patreon MUST follow those rules in order to use those payment options.
If they don't, the payment options will deny services to them and they will loose a large portion of their audience, running costs will increase, coverage will fall as well as leading to potential future legal troubles.
The rules seem fairly shady to me. Especially if the content is just art such as 2d or 3d drawn images or animation. I might understand if it's real people, but if the people are consenting adults and participate in a fictional piece of art it doesn't seem to make sense.
- Aug 3, 2017
- 579
- 1,424
The argument about the rules is a separate one and I agree that they don't make sense (for the most part) and that there is a huge double standard for enforcing them by those that make them (Governments, Corporations, CC Companies etc.).
That is NOT the point here though. The point is that people are NOT doing their homework or even trying to get any information on the actual problem and are blindly blaming patreon, when patreon is as much a victim of the times as anyone.
Patreon is a business and is clearly willing to dip into the Adult market so long, as with any business, the returns are worth it.
In the case of the banned content, the returns are NOT worth it.
Why should they risk their business and the livelihoods of hundreds of thousands of creators, including other adult game creators who DON'T have banned content just so a small group can add incest or beasty etc. to their games?
You must be registered to see the links
All = 246,064 creators with at least 1 paying member / $24,279,443 (excludes hidden earnings)
You must be registered to see the links
Adult games = 6,624 creators with at least 1 paying member / $2,105,490 (excludes hidden earnings)
From a business stand point it makes no sense to risk 24 million for 2 million and to risk potential growth of the business that 246 000 creators can pull in over a large number of different categories i.e. music, writing, photography, coding etc. etc. etc. compared to 6600 in a very small number of categories and the banned content groups are even smaller.
Not only are these people too lazy to think for themselves or at the very least look up the information but they are also focusing all their anger at the wrong target. That is three fails in a row.
All those moaning about patreon and bans can comfortably be ignored as quacks.
- Dec 8, 2023
- 64
- 122
- Aug 3, 2017
- 579
- 1,424
Ah yes, your post, overflowing with facts, information, sources and details....oh wait
but thank you for helping to prove my point for me....
- Jun 10, 2017
- 10,130
- 14,809
The rules include none real people because of a bad set of circumstances.
Someone reported, not to Patreon but directly to the payment processors, that there were peoples on Patreon that were engaged in prostitution. Then those persons discovered adult games and their underage, incest, non consensual sex and bestiality content, and obviously reported it too.
I'm almost sure that payment processors didn't cared that much about drawing and 3D renders, but they had to get rid of the prostitution thing. And they didn't had for moral reason, but for legal reason, they could lost their right to exist if they are involved in such activity.
All this led to a mess where Patreon was facing a wall that they can't get around. There's no way payment processors would have been pleased by a "ok, we will do what you ask for, but only for this or that". Would the issue only by incest, bestiality, none consensual sex, it would have been possible to say that they get rid of everything that involve real persons.
But for the prostitution and underage content, it was just impossible. It would have meant "we accept to be used as platform to fund prostitution/p*d*shit, but only if you just post drawing of the girls"... And, well, I don't have too much difficulties to imagine that it wouldn't have been received as well as expected.
I think the larger issue is that this shouldn't really be discussed at all. It's not really the business of a credit card company to discuss what is moral or not. Nor should they be involved in that type of discussion. They're simply the people that provide means for payment in an exchange. I don't understand how they can be accused of anything. It seems that something is wrong with the way the law works. It's allowing persons who disagree with certain ideas to pressure companies into not putting out content that makes them uncomfortable.
- Jun 10, 2017
- 10,130
- 14,809
But it's their business to discuss what they have the right to do and what they are strictly forbidden, by the international regulation, to do.
But well, I'll not even loose my time answering more. You can't teach a fish how to climb, it's far above its cognitive abilities.
- Aug 3, 2017
- 579
- 1,424
The problem is you are making the same mistake others have made and not realizing what the larger issue really is. In order to see what the larger issue is, you need to look at the big picture, right now you are looking at it from only one view point.
(explained below)
Ok let's look at the bigger picture, let's say for argument sake that the CC companies, investors etc. do NOT implement a set of rules over content.
Now a story breaks, Visa and master card fund creators of child abuse / exploitation images. The story lists realistic drawings, realistic 3d images and realistic AI images. In the same story it goes on to detail how the companies knew of these creations but did nothing and continued to offer their services to them, the story adds that among these, there were also adult games found containing incest, bestiality, rape, drugs use, murder (guro) etc.
Now putting aside for the moment the "acceptance" to the games / kinks (not the others) found in communities such as ours, how do you realistically think the world (general public) would react?
Do you have any idea of how important public image is to financial institutions? I'm sure you've heard the term investor confidence? What about people being worried their account might be frozen during an investigation? How many companies do you think would want to have their names and business associated with financial institutions that knowing handled money for people who created content NOT accepted by society?
I haven't even gotten to the legal issues that would arise etc.
The fact that you even wrote this sentence is very troubling and shows you're clearly lacking in either understanding or knowledge or both. First, four words, fraud, laundering, offshore accounts. It is anything but simple....
Either they knew money was going through their service to fund those creations, which most people would loose their shit over
or
They didn't know and they are completely incompetent, in which case who would want a financial service like that handling their money?
This part I partially agree with on a personal level, I find it strange that people can enjoy incest in shows and movies and cartoons but games are not allowed. I personally think this means many people missed out on many gorgeous milf's and gilf's!
That being said, the law has ALWAYS been slow to catch up and as long as people keep blaming the wrong parties it will be even slower. Plus almost all those moaning about patreon would never dare write their government or governments representatives to ask that MOST (not all should be in my personal opinion) of these kinks be legalized for all fiction.
That has nothing to do with it, I'm pretty sure many of those execs have some pretty kinky ideas and habits. It's about company image, reputation and standing.
I'm not sure why you do not understand the situation or concept here? Most of the people on this site would NEVER share the games they play or the porn they watch with family or friends, let alone a stranger. what do YOU think a stranger's reaction would be to hearing...
"I played a game last night, this mom let her son fuck her in the ass and then she took their dog for a walk and it fucked her in the park, after that she went to a spa and had 2 guys piss on her..."
Now if people don't want to be known to be associated with that in the general public, what makes you think banks and CC Companies would? and do you think the general public or other businesses would want to use banks who help creators of that kind of content by letting them use their services?
Until the laws get changed and the publics image of these kinks in games changes this is the reality of the situation.
Legal issues would be the payment processor's CEO's asshole will pucker getting a letter saying the SEC is coming to audit them for their failures to notice money moving around in things that could potentially be illegal. Then they have to try and convince the SEC that they did not know what was happening; which probably will fail and then someone is in federal prison. SEC is the truly terrifying boogeyman of the rich and the financial sector. Ain't nobody in the financial sector risking an audit for someones incest porn.
- Dec 5, 2017
- 820
- 1,668