2D Feedback on 2d-Resources

Darwin7

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Mar 5, 2018
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Heyho,
recently I started (or rather restarted) training the art of Tilesets. Sprites are planned aswell.
First thing I did were Naruto/Boruto Fanart Tiles.. won't be the only thing though.

RPG Maker MV
House00 A.png House00 B.png House00 C.png

What do you guys think?

UPDATE:
Portraits01.png
Some portrait-bases.. WIP.
I tried to incorporate Sunahara's style. Took me three refernces each (Pose, Style, Face).
Some input?
 
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Saki_Sliz

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May 3, 2018
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Impressive tile work.
I'm at the point were I have to get back into tile work for my own projects, but I don't want to spend all the hours just yet.
 

Darwin7

Member
Mar 5, 2018
186
629
Thanks :)
Dunno if they'll ever be used.. ^^"

The advantage of tiles is that you can make one piece at a time. ;)
Portraits02.png
Colorized them :giggle:
 
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Saki_Sliz

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The issue I have is I make isometric tiles, trying to make Diablo 1 like games, but the issue is having textures that either cover multiple materials, or the fact that afterwards there is still the work of putting the world together and often I have to code tools just for that, so designing a system tends to slow me down, but that is because I don't use pre made system which is my own fault.
 

Darwin7

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Mar 5, 2018
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Yeah.. isometric tiles are a pain in the butt... -.-"
Got no advice for that...^^"
 

Saki_Sliz

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May 3, 2018
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Sweet! cute pose :D

How long have you been doing art, and adult art? I'm going to guess you're still an early artist, like myself, at least in terms of someone who hasn't settled on a style yet and refined said style. Which kinda every artist may still think of themselves as early if they always keep trying to grow and do better.

Seeing your art makes me feel motivated, motivated to talk about art :D and what better than to just talk about myself as if I'm important or something special :p

copying/mimicking other styles is what myself and other newer artists tend to excel at, were we are still focusing on the technicalities and trying to achieve a specific look. Meanwhile, a more veteran artist has settled down on a particular style at least once, because they need to focus on generating content either to make an income (many deviant artist have to rely on quick drawings to make enough money) or at least make their mark.

When I say I'm more of a technical artist, I mean, I don't really have fun drawing or making a set of characters. I would have more fun taking images (a set of characters like what you have drawn), slicing them into layers, meshing them, rigging and setting up a control panel to make characters animateable (both in-game and pre-rendered) and doing all the grunt work that could bring art to life. As a result, I tend to not get enough practice to easily draw at a quality I would want, but I've develope plenty of tricks and skills that allow for me to reach the quality I want, it just takes longer. I've been doing art for 5 years (starting from stick figures) and only in the past few weeks have I finally developed the knowledge and skill to hone in on my ideal female character design type, to do so repeatably and consistently, and now I'm working on techniques/coded-tools to really help accelerate mass character designing. I want to be able to bang out high quality character previews for game devs in 6 to 3 hours, and be able to make massive changes in as little as 30 minutes (only possible with the tool design I have in mind), before being able to move to the next character/pose. With this, art should now be achievable for my short attention span, and I can start to get the practice I need. But as for painting and backgrounds, I'm still way out of practice. Looking at some of your other postings it looks like you've done some pretty decent backgrounds yourself.
 

Darwin7

Member
Mar 5, 2018
186
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Nice to hear my works motivate you. :)

I, myself, started drawing regularly in my teens. Now I'm in my Mid-twenties... So ten years I guess? ^^"
It's just that I've got the privilege to draw what I want and how I want.
No need to push out stuff like crazy or stick to one style.


Personally I'm more interested in modding since my creativity and patience don't suffice for anything bigger.
That's why I enjoy analyzing and applying other styles.^^

Many of my pieces are actually split into parts. Just like a jointed paperdoll... :)

That's sounds like quite the project. Coding is magic to me...^^"
 

Saki_Sliz

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May 3, 2018
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*excited clapping!* (つ☯ᗜ☯)つ

"jointed paperdoll" so if you wanted to, you could throw your work into Blender or Live2D and use them to give a bit of animation. Cool to hear you try to keep your work organized and editable.

In my earlier phases, when I tried to go for a more realistic style, and knew less about schematic rhetoric, I always had the issue that I couldn't tell if a pose or character was going to look good on not until I put all the work to paint and shade them. I say york work looks fantastic.

As for the hair, I have 3 tips that you could try that shouldn't be too much effort. As it is now, I think it looks good, reminds me of how the Teen Titans show did it, or how Shadman does it: incoming wall of text :p

~ 1 trick I call 'over shadow,' I haven't seen any discussion on ideas that touch this, so I don't know if there is an official term or why it works but the trick is, you shade (just the shadow) something like normal (ie, cell shade like you did with the legs) to what you think looks good and realistic, you save that, then you keep adding more shadow, just mesh it up, go overboard, but try to be consistent with how you do this to the whole thing (in this case just the hair). After you are done, zoom out and see how you feel about it, you may be shocked.

I theorize that the reason this sometimes makes a work pop more, and look better (often works better with darker backgrounds, high contrast color pallet, or characters that are going to be zoomed out) because it takes advantage of two properties that come from schematic abstraction. When you first shade, you are first working to try to communicate how the light interacts with the object, you try to communicate the shape using the shadow, and basically while it can be accurate even when you zoom out, you are focusing too much on the detail. What I think happens when you go ham with the shadow is that, it obscures all that detail and instead communicates the key point, that is, what is the simple shape and where is the light. From what I can tell, our brains just drop unneeded details, so you can inspect the hair and say, yess that is accurate, but when you are looking at the image overall (like in a game or when seeing it for the first time) unless you focus on the details, the brain drops it. The only time it does not is if smooth grayscale (photos or 3D renders, made gray, you can notice the details of the hair and lighting without having to actually try to focus or look for it). So I think the first benefit of this is that it uses abstract rhetoric to translate your image from "here are the details" to "this is a thing, there is light on the side of it" which is all the brain needs to know and it will fill in the rest. The second thing I think that helps make it pop is just that it adds more contrast (further improving clear rhetoric) and contrast just seems to work with stylized and cell-shaded work as far as I can tell. Basically, add more shadow (mimc what is going on with the side of the head/legs), and then make a copy and go crazy with more shadow, and see which you like better.

~ 2 'make interesting' is another trick. Basically adding a bit of detail to either make something more interesting, or harder/easier to read. If the detail is small, you need lots of it, this makes it hard to read and sometimes that is desirable. An example being hair with a 3D character, if all the strands are one color it looks really dumb and fake, you can see the hair, and you can spot how all the hair is just following the same path, but by making the hair color change randomly, it obscures the pattern (the shape of the hair) by making not as easy to see all the hairs as the same or unified. This often is what you want when painting, to give the details and to obscure what is really going on (I find impressionist art is the best kind of example, where you can look into a detailed image and see that it is not really that detailed). Or you can do the opposite, you can add a bit of detail, but make it big and obvious, ot communicate an idea. The best way I can describe this is, rather than have the hair all one color, you add bans of hair that are a different color. These shouldn't be small, they can be simple and thin, a single stroke that follows the curvature of the hair. It not only communicates the hair's shape (without the need for shading) but breaks up the monolithic base color to make it a bit more interesting. However, this may not reflect what hair actually looks like. but something to try.

~ 3 'glossy contrast only' is a trick that I see used a lot, and infact you are sort of doing it now. The idea is that, with the hair, you don't really shadow it (other than maybe the inside hair and the split at the top, which you are already doing both), but you make the base color a bit dim and you focus on shading it by using highlights mostly. When using highlights to shade the hair, you can exaggerate the contrast by making the highlights brighter, but to prevent them from being the dominate feature rather than a detail, you have to shade a bit differently, where you focus on the thin glint coming off a few strinds of hair, or making what looks like a streak with many (a jagged line perpendicular to the flow of hair). I would say right now, you are more, blotching the highlights on as if the hair is a 3D object with a surface, whereas hair's interaction is much more complicated so it is easier just to focus on glints. It is kinda hard to say with words, so I'll guess I'll try to draw it.

my fix.png
Tried to keep the shadows simple by making it one big shadow (and to get it to better mimic the shading of the legs, where it isto one side. Also may the shadow a bit warmer for the hair). tried to focus more on the highlight by making them brighter (and saying on the warm side), as well as simplified (2 big streaks). I used gimp, so if you want to play with the shadow and highlight colors, let me know.

As for code, It is my second most favorite thing, I could talk your ear off about it, but I have already written too much for a reply
 
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Darwin7

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Mar 5, 2018
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I started drawing because I kinda have aphantasia.. or something similar.
Whenever I try to picture something it flashes up and then it's gone.
When you can't picture something in your mind you've gotta picture it on paper. Even now I never know the final outcome until the end. It's kinda a surprise.. ^^"

When I want to know beforehand I need references and multiple sketches slowly reaching my destination.
So I know that feeling of uncertainty.


Concerning your tips: English is my secondary so I may misunderstand you.. or don't get it at all...^^"

~1: So you mean make a shade-area and then a shade area in the shade area?

The colors themselves are just placeholders.. each is it's own layer. Until I create a color-scheme I like, I normally just put some fitting-ish colors in there. ^^"

You're absolutely right with the contrast. Even when the colors seem realistic more vivid colors are the way to go. If not the image will look extremely plastic.

Regular zooming (in and out) and flipping are a must aswell. :)


~3: Ah the famous circle of light.. :)

###
To be honest my bigger issue is the haircut itself... I don't like it, but I don't hate it..

That's also why I didn't take any effort in light and shadow ^^"
 

Saki_Sliz

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May 3, 2018
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Yeah, hair design is also one of the things I struggle with. I think what I'll do in the future is not worry so much about hair design, because I eventually want to be able to paint characters, and painted hair can look pretty amazing even if the shape and style is basically just a blob. you can do curly hair just by shaking a brush, simple enough.

~1: No, just one shadow layer for the image. But when you paint on the shadow, paint on more than you usually would. I don't mean darker or more layers, I just mean, increasing the area of the drawing covered by shadow, i guess would be the best way to word it.

I know withdrawing that I'm not the best at visualizing what it is I want, knowing exactly the curves I need. It is why I had to develop techniques and tools that allowed me to be more consistent. I have a hard enough time drawing a line from Point A to Point B. But when it comes to building physical things or even coding, where things work following rules and everything is technical, that I find it more intuitive.
 

Darwin7

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Mar 5, 2018
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...and I want to implement akaburs style additionally to this drag... -.-" I'm too lazy for such stuff...^^"

~1: Ah that ^^
Pose01-C.png
Took a bit more effort now... Still some unnecessary line straying around.. ^^"
 
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Saki_Sliz

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Cute! I think the hair looks much better with that extra bit of work with shading. The shirt definitely fits the style :D

Being able to do other styles is a great skill to have! I think the reason I want to focus on developing a style goes back to me being more technical than artistic. I don't want to make good art, such as finding styles I like and replicating them, but rather I want to deliver a particular experience with my art. It's kinda like drawing your favorite cartoon character I guess.

One of my many side projects I am working on is developing my own game engine, and designing it with the intent of making it mod able. I don't just mean mods as a feature, but rather making mods will be the main way I'll make my game. I know some games you can mode or run an injection attack to mod. Are you doing akaburs style just for fun, or are you hoping to do something with throwing yourself in their universe?
 

Darwin7

Member
Mar 5, 2018
186
629
Thanks:giggle:

There is nothing wrong with that "[...] it's about sending a message." ^^
It's just the frame.
The style is just a collection of things you're comfortable with afterall...
A technical approach can turn into a style aswell(y)

Is there something you're NOT doing? :)

Stumbled upon witch trainer again and thought: hm.. why not?
No paticular reason.. For now I'm honing my skills until I find something I want to do.. And maybe someone wants to use the stuff I create in the meantime.. dunno...^^"
 

Saki_Sliz

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May 3, 2018
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Well it looks like you're ahead of me.
Now that I am starting to get my style locked into place, one of my later steps is to build up a collection of favorite poses or pose variations.

I guess creating poses might be a good way of getting practice since one doesn't need to slow down to refine the character... hmmmm..

I know in one of my earlier tests with unity, I focused on making scripts and plugins to make it easier for artists of a team to make a game, since they could drag and drop their work into the game, that way they wouldn't need to talk to the programmer and wait a few days till they could see their work in-game and see what they needed to change. But since then I have walked away from the Unity game engine.