DMD Meta Discussion

greyelf

Well-Known Member
Nov 16, 2016
632
366
#41
... it seems a little extreme that D isn't asking her more experienced 'slut friend' for any backgrounds.
Is it possible that one of the reasons D hasn't asked her 'slut friend' for background is that she's worried she might become 'slutty' herself and that she (like many) have been told the being 'slutty' is wrong?
 

Cirro84

Resident Evil-doer, part-time Candyman
Dec 24, 2016
915
585
#42
I'd not give credit to the usual image boards as sources, as I am shitposting there myself. If you ever show up with a creation of your own be sure I am one of them to give you the creeps. Draw me a young chick or bloke, I'd make you feel bad and harass you for being a perv doing loli or shota cp. Sorry, it's just that I hardly can take most of the bunch seriously, won't exclude my own. And playing around with some sliders is not an argument. I wished dev hadn't blown up D's tits to balloons, I'd go for a healthy 'Jennifer' type all the way. What I really think is shit, most 'girls' need to look like they got their first plastic surgery with reaching their tenners. A turn off to me. There are smallish girls with little tits, needen't be nymphets imo. And I don't need to have Missis Titty Munster and her semon demons in every game that comes out. I'd rather go for normal body shapes. And a little laugh too. But no fetish I guess, boring normality.

Also how do you define 'acting like a loli' please?? D might not be acting as the brightest light, but she is sexy to me in her very own way (never mind the abused bodily features which is a crime). I do like to see girls who are not constantly forcing themselves onto others, manipulating relationships for their own advantage only (what Elena does, also the ex wife I think. Georgina seems a cool one, like her attitude). D might seem too naive and 'innocent' because maybe we are so used already to 'spoiled brat' characters with serious mental issues, in tv series, movies, games. But I come to believe she has her own motives to act the way she does, at least she seemed honest to what she'd like to achieve. And, because someone mentioned it above, she can say 'no, I don't want', which means she can give consent too. Even if she may not be 'experienced'. Just saying.

I think the dev got that built up quite fine. Not 'I get to fuck around (with daddy or someone else), just so. Never mind if I like it. Don't ask why, I crave me some cock ffs'. There is many a game where 'young girls' are portrayed like this, bimbo slut syndrome I call it, and young fellas like friggin morons on coke, rabid hamsters, or acting in servitude. Chicken shit. Still not sure about the mom encounter though... I really wanted to dislike her.
Please apologise, I'm in the mood right now for a rant... Just replied to another unpleasant user. :/

I got an interesting source too, if you don't mind. Actually it is pretty funny because it is this very disc I got to remember about it. Situation is: Italian comedy film, european cinema, time period 1940s to 1950s. The title is 'Don Camillo e Peppone' btw...
Right at the beginning a young girl arriving in town - where had she been? Had been sent to an 'internat' (sorta boarding school) for girls, only visiting family few times a year. Young and dumb (think of that time, plus sex ed wasn't a thing back then), having a crush on a boy, stiring shit <...> happy end, somehow.
I *had* to think about that film the moment I remembered it, comparing it to the game for reasons. The daughter did have similarities, such is what makes me get to feel very uncomfortably to be honest. Recognising such similarities to other media depicting societal circumstances gives me flashes of teenage angst. And I'm not a teen anymore! XD
 
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Cirro84

Resident Evil-doer, part-time Candyman
Dec 24, 2016
915
585
#43
Is it possible that one of the reasons D hasn't asked her 'slut friend' for background is that she's worried she might become 'slutty' herself and that she (like many) have been told the being 'slutty' is wrong?
That is actually a good question. Please remember the player doesn't have plenty of infos on the relationship of D and bff, I just thought it would be normal to Elena 'helping' D with situations, which she did (think of slutty outfit and stuff). They got to know each other for a 'long time' already, whatever that may imply. Now they are basically competing, with Elena in the lead, if we are honest... You got a point. Perhaps this is something for D to avoid like the plague, since E is with her, meeting her dad too. A lot of potential for conflict.

I am a bit worried (as mentioned) how D will transform in the end (with extra points and such). As to what role Elena will play I'm not sure either. For now players can 'date' both, but sooner or later there has to be a confrontation. If that gameplay should make any sense, that is. I am more concerned, because Elena might seem to be more 'experienced' (I wouldn't say she is really), it may be the D who is feeling abandoned at some point. You know, the fifth wheel nobody needs... If devs want to go that route they better hadn't protrayed E as the little bitchy 'best friend' of D.

We'll come back to this if there is some development in that direction, if you don't mind?? For now all is speculation, as there is mom having her 15 mins of fame I guess. What that means for pc? Somehow I'm feeling like a ping pong ball flipping around while playing this game. :D
 
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Cirro84

Resident Evil-doer, part-time Candyman
Dec 24, 2016
915
585
#44
Oh merde, parles-tu la langue français aussi? Had to talk with my granny in the 'language of mordor' too, at least what I felt. I am so bad when it comes to learning diff langs, oh my... You make me confess to it all.
Aaand history is a thing too. :) Wanted to prep a bit on communism and the 'anni di piombo' in Italy, so I thought it a good idea to show up with how they commemorated the transition of that period in media. So we are two of them, and I'm fucked for coming out of the closet. XD Are you my long lost sibling I didn't know of yet?? We probably had abandoned you in the woods...

About DmD, you can interpret a lot of games in this way, maybe depending on how prude you are. Loli this and shota that - to me it's more of a hen and egg situation - what was before?? Do not forget, the 'naive little nymphet' you already got 150+ years back, too, in the western culture. (Lewis Carroll anyone?? And he's an extreme example, think you gotta know.) And it's far far older to be honest, without going into detail.
So is it the 'naive girlie' topos, that had its peculiarity with the japanese culture coming to the west - or - do we have the loli / shota phenomenon as a truly separate development, and we need to take in consideration that this already formed western culture to some degree and our thinking about 'juvenile' characters first and foremost??
I grew up in a time when we knew cosplay already, and I'm not a youngster anymore. But I cannot remember girls did run around in short skirts, tits out, trying to be 'sexy' imitating a 'cute' eastern anime or game char that may be half their age in reality.

I do not believe this DmD game is created with such content in mind. There is a bigger market for games appealing to a wider audience, and truly young chars are mostly depicted as sidekicks. Although it is weird to have D being the naive 'lil Miss Sunshine', but as I said I do not think she is completely dumb fuck-brain dead, let alone out of her mind. I'm more worried about how her routes may end up, given the plans I had read about. Will it all end in corruption? Here I think the dev of Teacher's Pets hit the nail with the Meghan npc (think that's her name?), she is also sorta 'innocent' but mostly she is nervous and insecure about her body (again, big 'uns all the way :/). But there it is more believable to me. And you can play as an arse, don't have to. That is what me gusta the most. I got a choice.

The 'all chars are 18 at least, non-bloodrelated, I swear!' bs is because prudish Murica I believe. D could have been 16 years too, maybe this would fit better to her actions. Perfectly legal in enough countries around the planet. Also incest (which should be more worrying for you tbh) needn't be a thing. I guess the game would still sell like shit without that stuff, anyway. Some other creators prove it. But that is something to question the devs I'd say. I for once do think nobody is forced to play a game the way it is created. If you want you can imagine any other situation too. 'They are not 18, no way!' and 'why do they have to step-siblings?' - pages long convos about these topics is nonsense to me.

I am more concerned not about the phantasies and fetishes of some, but about them trying to make 'dreams' become reality. The other day I had read about a 20+ female, gotten knocked up by her 12+ year old pupil. I mean come on! Or is this better called normality nowadays?? This is why I hesitate to condemn a game like DmD in a hasty way. You may know - those who cry wolf once too often comes to mind. Our societies got perfectly real problems too, sadly. This game is not one, at least to me. And there are way worse games than DmD for sure.

And thinking of Patreon - this is really a very special platform. The moment I found out there were girls getting sponsored for 'cosplaying' (let's stick to that, think you know exactly what I mean.) and they had 'higher tiers' for their sugar daddies, with extras... For a moment I thought that could easily be placed on Pornhub or go to some other websites. Yeah, they better keep a watchful eye on some of their 'artists', and I don't know what is worse. A game some think might be inappropriate or real people using it like it's a softporn channel. :/

btw ty for your participation. Talking seriously to someone and not bubbling along is a precious opportunity, even here. I think I should tell you this. Should also try to write more concise I guess. XD
 
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Cirro84

Resident Evil-doer, part-time Candyman
Dec 24, 2016
915
585
#45
I would define "loli" as under 16.
Strictly speaking, Nabokov's "Lolita" was 12. So, 14-15 may be "senior" loli.
Yeah, and that's just a novel. Then you got reality punching back.

But DmD daughter isn't 12+, more like 16 - 18. Or 15+ if you wanted, I don't know. Mentally a little too naive, her body blown for a reason. Perhaps dev's imagination of a perfect girl?? I don't see any connection to this loli topic to be honest. There are way worse examples when it comes to games.
So what is this fuss about?? There are loli characters (having the body forms) in game or comic / film acting more like though heroines. Here it must be the mental state, not the appearance i guess. I really don't get it. Did you play Akabur's Witch Trainer maybe??
 

Cirro84

Resident Evil-doer, part-time Candyman
Dec 24, 2016
915
585
#46
Always fighting with my keyboard, since I got a non-standard one. Really dislike it. So I get you are here for the art in the games, a game has to be visually appealing to you?? DmD is one of the better I can say. They took care.
Wait what? 'In DMD for instance, D may not be a virgin already...' - you sure?? That is new to me. But I didn't play the latest version. Dev is changing older parts to adapt to story, which is smart by the way. Maybe they changed sth i don't know of yet?? Where did you get that from??
Yeah, Jen to me is also, wouldn't say perfect, but a really pretty one. Liked to see some normal sized chars for once, that's rare. They should have started with D more confident, given more content to npcs. But game centers around D. :/

Having highest expectations for certain genres of 'entertainment', yeah? Really?? That was brave. Good you settled down low. XD There are clichés about stuff like action films and porn vids for a reason, he he! Same goes for chick flicks and what not... Don't expect too much from games, too. Goes for normal and lewd ones. Check VNs on VNDB if you like, some got an in deep story to tell. Marble Syrup Re:Maid VN we have here btw, is Flash. Also go for some AIF, for the story. Nuova Malizia I liked very much. Good story, mystery and mobsters. ;)

Don't ever get me started about those female 'creators'. Despicable. I mean they can do this shit somewhere else too, I don't mind. They don't need to infest that place, can even make a tumblr and go sell their used knickers over there. One guy drawing baseball cards in art déco style, that's an artist I tell you! I'd pledge him but not a baseball fan. Given up on so many others calling themselves 'artists'...

Don't know about your ava... Is she an actress?? I'm bad when it comes to recognising prominent faces too I guess. Pretty sure there are gorgeous ones, maybe more beautiful. Beauty lies in the eye of the beholder they say.
 

apokat

Formerly '(/// -)'
Sep 25, 2016
220
88
#47
click these game over, click there game over too :D too much game over,
i hope there is no more game over choice :D

at least just give us penalty point, if our choice is wrong
 

greyelf

Well-Known Member
Nov 16, 2016
632
366
#48
I think some people see D as 'dumb' (or terms to that effect) because they confuse Knowledge (what you know) with Intelligence (what you can do with Knowledge). D displays a lack of knowledge about a number of sexual related subjects, although she seems intelligent enough to use reasoning (technique related to Intelligence) on the new knowledge as it's made available to her.
So personally I wouldn't say she's 'dumb' as such, instead I would say she's naive and innocent which are both knowledge related terms.
 
Aug 10, 2017
96
54
#49
In terms of basic, applied logic I think women are superior (group-wise) to men. I think that women value utility ( best example is cooking) more than men. It's as if women are more willing to climb a ladder rung-by-rung, but too many men stumble trying leaps rather than steps.

In DMD, D has been a quick study learning to cook, as well as being fairly proficient with tech gadgets. She is definitely not dumb.
But she has been portrayed as dumb too often : Dad gropes her and tells her it's not what you think and he proceeds to try to con her. She believes him! (Just contrast this to the first time Dad peeks at her in the shower. She catches him and he tries to con her. She is unbelieving and irate) ; last update D stopped jerking Dad because she didn't want explicit sex and he convinced her this act is not really sex.
So D wasn't dumb in the beginning (her biggest drawback was a lack of confidence); she has had several experiences whereby she should now be more confident (the scene where she manipulated the salesperson in the camera-shop, completely by herself); but somehow she is now PORTRAYED as dumb!
The DMD writers seem to have run out of ideas and now D is to be conned into sex acts. One notable patron imagined a scenario where Dad partially penetrates her and convinces her that only full penetration is full sex [an echo of our "threshold" banter] and she believes it. A DMD writer loved that scenario and pronounced, "You nailed it!".
D is an innocent : trusting, inexperienced, socially awkward but NOT "dumb" whatsoever. Unfortunately, the writers seem to be re-shaping her in order to get to the sex scenes with her. This "redo" changes D very much for the worse.
Is it possible that D is playing dumb in order to get what she wants? She is 18, after all. If you remember being 18, you know that you had a tendency to know everything, while at the same time, knowing absolutely nothing. So, this is, perhaps, her way of getting what she wants, without having to feel guilt from it... although she obviously does. That implies intelligence, at least to some degree.
 

Gomly1980

Well-Known Member
Jul 4, 2017
4,519
5,753
#50
It's taken a turn for the creepy.

It's no longer a mutual thing it's a father grooming his daughter. Some people find that a turn on and that's great for them but what started out as a decent story now has a sinister edge to it.

It started out as father getting taboo feelings about his daughter and going down the "dating" route but now it's turning into a guy pushing his clueless daughter into being his fuck toy.

It's going over into more of a corruption story and that's not my thing.
 
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Jeff Steel

Well-Known Member
Game Developer
Jun 2, 2017
538
1,185
#51
In terms of basic, applied logic I think women are superior (group-wise) to men. I think that women value utility ( best example is cooking) more than men. It's as if women are more willing to climb a ladder rung-by-rung, but too many men stumble trying leaps rather than steps.

In DMD, D has been a quick study learning to cook, as well as being fairly proficient with tech gadgets. She is definitely not dumb.
But she has been portrayed as dumb too often : Dad gropes her and tells her it's not what you think and he proceeds to try to con her. She believes him! (Just contrast this to the first time Dad peeks at her in the shower. She catches him and he tries to con her. She is unbelieving and irate) ; last update D stopped jerking Dad because she didn't want explicit sex and he convinced her this act is not really sex.
So D wasn't dumb in the beginning (her biggest drawback was a lack of confidence); she has had several experiences whereby she should now be more confident (the scene where she manipulated the salesperson in the camera-shop, completely by herself); but somehow she is now PORTRAYED as dumb!
The DMD writers seem to have run out of ideas and now D is to be conned into sex acts. One notable patron imagined a scenario where Dad partially penetrates her and convinces her that only full penetration is full sex [an echo of our "threshold" banter] and she believes it. A DMD writer loved that scenario and pronounced, "You nailed it!".
D is an innocent : trusting, inexperienced, socially awkward but NOT "dumb" whatsoever. Unfortunately, the writers seem to be re-shaping her in order to get to the sex scenes with her. This "redo" changes D very much for the worse.
The idea I posed about "partial penetration" is not sex was from the Daughter's POV, not from the father's POV. At some point, the D gets involved in her own self deception. Of course, it would require something that drives her. One would hope her sexual drive kicks in, leading her to be her own self deceiver. Not an unknown thing for those with addictions to involve themselves into self deception. If D is addicted to romance, and then else's and sexual romance, it could happen. I know it is the trope that men are the sexually addictive and driven - I prefer D to be more of the driver in this game and not the MC.
 

Jeff Steel

Well-Known Member
Game Developer
Jun 2, 2017
538
1,185
#52
It's taken a turn for the creepy.

It's no longer a mutual thing it's a father grooming his daughter. Some people find that a turn on and that's great for them but what started out as a decent story now has a sinister edge to it.

It started out as father getting taboo feelings about his daughter and going down the "dating" route but now it's turning into a guy pushing his clueless daughter into being his fuck toy.

It's going over into more of a corruption story and that's not my thing.
Hmmm. What parts make you see this as a "grooming" game? Personally, the Richard photo shoot did this for me. Preferably, more empowerment of Daughter so becomes more of a Daughter driven story is what I'd prefer. Now, if one just can't get past the idea that a father and daughter can never become sexual partners, then I'm not sure for some they can never accept Daughter's free agency.
 

Gomly1980

Well-Known Member
Jul 4, 2017
4,519
5,753
#53
Hmmm. What parts make you see this as a "grooming" game? Personally, the Richard photo shoot did this for me. Preferably, more empowerment of Daughter so becomes more of a Daughter driven story is what I'd prefer. Now, if one just can't get past the idea that a father and daughter can never become sexual partners, then I'm not sure for some they can never accept Daughter's free agency.
When one person has to convince the other, younger and naive, person to do something then that's taking an entirely sinister turn.

It's no longer about love, it's about getting what he wants out of it regardless.

I've never said a father and daughter can't become lovers and that's how it started but that's not how it's going now.
 
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Jeff Steel

Well-Known Member
Game Developer
Jun 2, 2017
538
1,185
#54
When one person has to convince the other, younger and naive, person to do something then that's taking an entirely sinister turn.

It's no longer about love, it's about getting what he wants out of it regardless.

I've never said a father and daughter can't become lovers and that's how it started but that's not how it's going now.
Rationalizations started perhaps with the kisses and certainly with the breast massages. How would you have done it differently?
 

Kyle Mercury

Member
Game Developer
Jul 19, 2017
64
101
#55
Just finished playing the current release. At first I really wasn't into emily but by the end her personality got me.
 
May 4, 2017
63
202
#56
I think our modern society and education system is the biggest example of the older and more experienced ppl trying to convince the younger and more naive to do their bidding. In DmD the daughter is not completely averse to the idea of a "romantic" adult relation with the father as we have seen through her thoughts. But i do agree that the whole situation would be closer to reality if we disregard the "over 18" tag in game, something that i guess the devs had to do to avoid legal problems with their project...
We can't forget that the term "consenting sexual partner" has a really wide age range across the globe (anything from 12 to 19).
 

Gomly1980

Well-Known Member
Jul 4, 2017
4,519
5,753
#57
The weirdest--Hall of Shame all the way : I read of a game where the MC wants to bang a reluctant babe, there and then ; the choices are to either ask her if she is OK with that or just force her without asking ; forcing her is the right answer while asking her is GAME-OVER!!
I saw one like that with a mother helping her son.

She says, emphatically, do not put it in. You get a choice to either stop or put it in and put it in is the right answer so basically it's a rape game with people trying to justify it in the comments section.
 
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Thialf

Active Member
Jun 4, 2017
385
309
#58
Regarding the "grooming", I think what happens in DMD, is what happens with many/most couples where the male partner has more experience and/or is more eager to progress the sexual relation further/quicker.

In the DMD setting, this is of course a bit suspect, given the big age difference. The blood relation is less relevant in my opinion because they didn't know each other at the start of the game. As somebody said earlier in this thread, "Dad" is just a title...

Nevertheless I don't see how this "grooming" could be avoided.

That said, I too would like to see some further romantic (non-sexual) development between F and D.
 

Gomly1980

Well-Known Member
Jul 4, 2017
4,519
5,753
#59
Regarding the "grooming", I think what happens in DMD, is what happens with many/most couples where the male partner has more experience and/or is more eager to progress the sexual relation further/quicker.

In the DMD setting, this is of course a bit suspect, given the big age difference. The blood relation is less relevant in my opinion because they didn't know each other at the start of the game. As somebody said earlier in this thread, "Dad" is just a title...

Nevertheless I don't see how this "grooming" could be avoided.

That said, I too would like to see some further romantic (non-sexual) development between F and D.
Not even close.

When you have a more experienced partner the sex is still consensual and you both know what is going on, in DmD he tries to convince her what to do and then justifies it.

It's not a dating game, it's not a "love" story that some people claim it's just another corruption game.
 

Thialf

Active Member
Jun 4, 2017
385
309
#60
Even by the end of Day 1, the reunion has been a success. They are bonded as Father and Daughter.
Normal father - daughter bonding takes years and also involves seeing each other in not-so-sexy situations.

To think that living under one roof as father and daughter for 18 years has the same result as spending one day as adults together is, well, bullshit.

Really, have a look at the Wikipedia article regarding Genetic Sexual Attraction:


Back to DMD, D may be very innocent but she is an adult (18+ as per dev statement). She also knows what a dick is and what to do with it at a basic level. She is not a small child who has no idea what's going on. Therefore it's not grooming.

Whether or not F is an asshole, is another discussion.
At the moment, it seems that on the D-only path, the player is awarded by being able to go a bit further with D than on the Elena/Georgina path.
Personally I would prefer a path where F takes things more slowly, let D take the initiative and is rewarded by additional romantic scenes / love points.